Did you carry the placard you promised – or was that just empty rhetoric?

Apparently Peter Tatchell – someone we can take a little more seriously – did carry one which said something like “Hamas and Israel stop bombing civilians”.

I saw that the “we are Hamas” crowd were there after all.

Nicely put, Sunny – people wouldn’t have to explain and almost justify their views for any other conflict, but you do a good job of it here. Thanks for coming on the march.

I’ve had a look at the stuff on HP and I find it very hard to describe such outright racist and murder-supporting commenters as “liberal-left”.

I might write my own report too – I was in the Hyde Park underpass when riot police, unprovoked, rushed the crowd. I saw a man knocked out cold on the ground by the police, and will be making an official complaint about another time I saw a riot policeman hit some people.

We can also note that there is a peace movement in Israel as Sunny you have done to your credit, 10,000 people marched in Tel Aviv which is encouraging.

The Harry’s Place stuff is pretty barking, its not engaging with the peace movement in Israel but instead coming up with articles defending the ground invasion on the grounds of ‘compassion’.

The pro-war left are not actually left just pro-war.

Any way we should not worry about HP but get on with building the peace protests.

The Islamphobia card is played against Gaza even though many Palestinians are Christians and the most regressive state in the world is Saudi Arabia which funds most of the assualts on tolerant forms of islam…and Saudi Arabia is Bush’s favourite state in the Middle East after Isreal.

Well put Sunny. Just as a footnote. Not all right-wingers are ‘bombers’. See Peter Oborne’s recent short in his Mail column:

“Defenders of the Israeli government have spent the past week claiming that Britain would behave just as ruthlessly if it came under attack from, say, a neighbouring territory in the same way that Israel has been targeted by militants in Gaza.

This analogy is utterly false. As we all know, Britain was attacked over a period of 30 years by the IRA, resulting in the deaths of hundreds of innocent people and the near annihilation of the Cabinet.

But ministers never ordered the bombing of the Falls Road in Belfast, the town of Dundalk or any of the other Republican strongholds. The one exception, when indiscriminate deaths resulted during the events of Bloody Sunday in 1969, has been the subject of a public inquiry. On the contrary, the British reaction to terrorist attacks on our own soil has focused on sensible policing and the opening up of lines of communication with the enemy. The eventual outcome was a peaceful end to a terrible conflict. Israel has a great deal to learn from the honourable way Britain dealt with Irish terrorism.”

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-1104524/PETER-OBORNE-Ditch-Speaker-Martin-make-Vince-Cable-Chancellor-freeze-Tories–Browns-masterplan-2009.html

Anthony>
While British reaction to IRA terrorism could be characterised as sensible policing (I’m sure some would wish to argue on that point, mentioning shoot to kill etc) I am sure you would agree the current reaction to ‘the terrorist threat” definitely cannot be said to to be proportional in any way. Attempts to raise detention limits, ID Cards and a whole raft of other measures right down to the harassment of the public for merely taking photographs, can all be characterised as a complete over-reaction.
As to whether the UK would go to war over this sort of thing, I rather think it would depend on if the perpetrating group could be adequately painted black enough with some kind of dossier dodgy or otherwise.

“Apparently Peter Tatchell – someone we can take a little more seriously…”

[From decentpedia.blogspot.com]

Serious
Euphemism

See-Ree-Yuss

Polite term indicative of a person undergoing a spectacularly extroverted mid-life crisis, which manifests itself in ferocious demands for respect and acceptance, with sundry other quirks.

Generally occurring in men aged 35-60 who have experienced an epiphany, an outbreak of Seriousness often causes embarrassing, bellicose rants, the adoption of bizarre mental and verbal tics and a deranged desire to cruise up and down the streets of the middle east showing off one’s brand-new F-22 Raptor to young ladies.

Following a period of self-examination, the Serious often concocts a strange and alarming fantasy world and can lash out violently at those who intrude into his inner psychodrama.

The condition can fatally damage the Serious’s personal life and career, as the extroverted nature of the disorder leads him to seek wide publicity for his new-found certainties, not unlike a slightly slow toddler proudly showing a dinner guest his whiffy, full-up potty.

Thankfully, men afflicted with all but the most acute Seriousness can overcome the condition by podgering their secretary, or by purchasing a high-powered motorcycle and driving it into a stationary vehicle at seventy miles-per-hour.

Some, however, will never shake the condition and are condemned to a life of Seriousness.

“There’s no doubt about it – Martin Amis is one of Britain’s most Serious authors.”

See also Unserious.

Tony – Not only do I agree with you about the current disproportionality of the current response I am doing something about it along with Henry Porter, Sunny and others – see
http://www.modernliberty.net
My point was simply that not _all_ right-wingers have the ‘bomb em’ mentality on Muslims. And, I regret to say, the current “raft of measures” you describe are the product of a Labour government. Cheers!

[6] I don’t think Tatch has got anything he wants to show off to ladies, young or otherwise…

cjcjc – I’ts impossible to prevent people from coming to a march, but I’m glad the ‘We are Hamas’ crowd were so small hardly anyone saw them. I certainly didnt at Trafalgar square. So despite attempts at HP to paint the march as over-run by fascists, it wasn’t. I’m sure you’ll be disappointed.

I got there too late, but I’m happy that Peter carried that sign. I can do it next week but got there too late this week to do anything as I overslept. Some of your HP’ers seem to think its a massive deal because as soon as someone criticises Hamas they’ll get jumped. I bet if a brown person even said ‘boo’ to you lot, you’d crap your pants and run away screaming terrorist. Heh.

Anthony – thank you, and good point about Oborne. I think he is one of the few principled people on the right, and I said so when he did that documentary on British Muslims too.

Derek – true, and good point about the Israeli peace protests.

Rayyan – did you go to that. I’ve been sent an eyewitness report on that too, and am going to put it up on my blog today,

Hi Sunny and all,

Had a good photographer on hand and have posted a story linking to the photos:

http://hangbitch.com/node/187

Did a number of interviews with protestors as well, so will post those as well tonight or tomorrow after sorting through the photos.

Distinguished myself in true antipodean fashion by doing a ten minute interview with the famous theatre director Jonathan Miller without realising who he was. My analysis may not be that – err, deep, but the photos are good and give an idea of the scale of the event, which I thought was very impressive. Can’t believe the coppers are wandering around saying only 6000 people showed.

Cheers, Kate

I wish I hadn’t looked at Harry’s Place, it is so disturbing when people rewrite history to fit things into their political spectrum and the lack of recognition concerning the loss of human life seems positively sociopathic.

Sunny – very even-handed of you to post the HP link.

And you are prepared to call a spade a spade, ie call Hamas for the fascists (for want of a better word) that they are, unlike many who seem to regard them as some kind of heroic resistance movement.

Sunny saying that only a few people on the right are principled appears to be a dangerous way down the road of believing in one’s ability to sit in judgement on other peoples consciences. Are saying the left or liberals are more principled than the right?

I saw that the “we are Hamas” crowd were there after all.

No, you saw a photo of one home-made placard in a partisan post on Harry’s Place. I was on that march and I heard not one “we are Hamas” chant, nor anything else particularly beyond the pale.

“We are all Hamas now”. Anybody remember that? Only supporting Palestinian civilians my arse!

I didn’t hear any “We are all Hamas now” chant, Miller. What time was this, and where were you situated during the protest?

Miller wasn’t there. Only people who care about the plight of the Palestinian people would’ve turned up. Miller seemingly only wants to score points against Hamas. Well done, Miller!