I have a sense that George Osorne (and to a lesser extent D. Cameron) is being given rope while commenators work up confidence in the design of suitable knots. Listen for when the trap drops, Sunny.

Is Osborne saying households were wrong to buy cheaper Chinese goods? I thought the Tories were for free trade? Is there something wrong with this?

I’ve never been convinced that the Tories are all that keen on free trade. They’re still deeply ambivalent about the EU, which is the largest free trade area in the world, and they’re still a nationalist party in some respects. I rarely hear any Tory arguing that free trade might be good because workers in other countries might benefit from access to British consumers, or that the downward (or at least restraining) pressure on prices might help to make goods more affordable for those on low incomes in the UK. Given the choice, I suspect that many Tories would be more comfortable with pulling up the drawbridge and protecting their favourite companies from competition.

Or it could just be that Osbourne is an idiot.

Well I am hardly a Tory, but that doesn’t stop ‘do nothing’ from being perhaps the best economic strategy available to any government at the moment: http://blog.iea.org.uk/?p=222

I thought David Cameron’s speech yesterday, whether one agrees with it or not, should have put a stop to do this ‘do nothing’ jibe that Labour continuously pokes at the Tories. The fact is they can’t do anything anyway, and as the Opposition they are within their rights to criticise Government strategy if they believe it to be detrimental to the economy, as they have correctly pointed out with the ridiculous VAT cut.

With the risk of jumping on bandwagons, get Vince Cable in there to sort it out!

One journalist has called Osborne out (a bit) – Jeremy Paxman:

JP: OK. There’s a problem isn’t there? Something has happened since you had your unfortunate difficulties on a yacht and since then you have made one public speech about the economy, which is the role of the shadow chancellor, and he’s made nine?

GO: Well first of all I just completely reject, I don’t know where you’ve got that from.

JP: By totting up the number of speeches that have been made.

GO: Jeremy everyday, indeed today if you open the London Evening Standard there is an article by me which actually came out before David Cameron gave his speech, I was on the World At One, I have just done before doing this a whole stream of interviews on not only the BBC but believe it or not some other news organisations…

JP: You’re like the man who walks behind the horse with the bucket?

http://www.tom-watson.co.uk/2009/01/end-of-jeremy-paxman-interview-with-george-osborne/

If Narratives were money we would not be sinking into the sea. My abiding image of this period will be of the nasty rat faced Yvette Cooper spitting out lies she knows are lies about Labour paying down debt .

I thought David Cameron’s speech yesterday, whether one agrees with it or not, should have put a stop to do this ‘do nothing’ jibe that Labour continuously pokes at the Tories. The fact is they can’t do anything anyway, and as the Opposition they are within their rights to criticise Government strategy if they believe it to be detrimental to the economy, as they have correctly pointed out with the ridiculous VAT cut.

True, the job of Her Majesty’s Opposition is to, well, oppose…but it’s hard to see how that’s going to work in the context of the failure of the dominant model of free-market economics for the last 30 years…when you’re the party of free market economics (including the begetters of the dominant model of the last 30m years). I mean, does he believe in government borrowing or not? Moreover:

First, we have to help the innocent victims of Labour’s recession – the pensioners and the savers. They did the right thing during the age of irresponsibility and now their incomes are being unfairly decimated as the Bank of England has been forced to cut interest rates. A further rate cut later this week may be necessary, but it will add to their misery.

Anybody who became a pensioner over the last 10 years had already ‘done the right thing’ before Labour even came to power. Presumably, in order to keep savers and pensioners happy, interests rates would have to be high enough to offer a good rate of return/incentive to save. Nice if you’ve got a big lump sum (you get a tax-free bonus, which you probably won’t spend), pretty useless for everyone else – that’s assuming, of course, that Osborne will somehow be able to ‘make’ the MPC set interest rates at that kind of level.

I increasingly get the feeling that Osborne got lucky when he panicked the government over inheritance tax, and he’s been trying for the same strategy ever since – but now the economic context is different (and Brown gives enough of an impression of A Man With A Plan, which isn’t saying much considering he bought into the same economic model), neither it or he is working in any coherent form (as his interview on Newsnight yesterday demonstrated…again).

JP: You’re like the man who walks behind the horse with the bucket?

[laughs - I must have missed that bit, though I think asking about Deripaska allows Osborne off the hook]

redpesto

I agree with what you say, I think that George Osborne would not make a great Chancellor and it seems that David Cameron might be starting to think the same thing.

My point wasn’t designed to defend the Tories in this economic debacle, I just get increasingly annoyed with the soundbites that pepper politics, such as the ‘do nothing’ approach, that demonstrate political posturing and nothing of substance.

My point wasn’t designed to defend the Tories in this economic debacle, I just get increasingly annoyed with the soundbites that pepper politics, such as the ‘do nothing’ approach, that demonstrate political posturing and nothing of substance.

Jeebus, yes – but I have low expectations of New Labour minsters’ ability to do a forensic evisceration of the Opposition (or maybe I just miss Robin Cook).

but it’s hard to see how that’s going to work in the context of the failure of the dominant model of free-market economics for the last 30 years…when you’re the party of free market economics

Well dagnabbit if only the Soviet Union Zimbabwe and many more had not hidden the benefits of a planned economy so skilfully we might have avoided that wrong turn.
Well done Red Pesto I have finally found someone the creationists can call nuts .

( More celery in your ear ?)

Well dagnabbit if only the Soviet Union Zimbabwe and many more had not hidden the benefits of a planned economy so skilfully we might have avoided that wrong turn.

And you jump to the conclusions that (a) the only alternative was a planned economy (b) I’m in favour of a Soviet-style economic system based on what, exactly?

I thought Osbourne came across quite well on Newsnight. He stuck to his guns and articulated what he would offer to savers given the circumstances at the time. He got across the message that the Tories would not ignore the prudent for the irresponsible. His problem is his high toff voice and boyish looks, which in modern media prejudice, is deemed unacceptable. Paxman’s questioning, to any reasonable person, was pointless and repetitive. His familiar tactic of asking the same irrelevant question is supposed to portray the interviewee as evasive. I suspect the BBC patronisingly believes the average viewer incapable of seeing through this ruse. Maybe, they are right.

His problem is his high toff voice and boyish looks, which in modern media prejudice, is deemed unacceptable.

He’s young, can at least string some kind of sentence together and has a full head of hair: he’s perfectly telegenic compared to say, William Hague – and is nowhere near as other-worldly-seeming as, say, Oliver Letwin – blaming the media isn’t really an explanation (after all, look at Cameron).

I enjoy Paxo but no-one watches Newsnight so who cares?

But you are right about Osborne…he is not a strong performer.

Brown would be shitting his pants if they broguth back Clarke…but they won’t, will they?

I’m certainly willing to mock Tory inconsistancy over free trade but I seem to have missed the memo when the Left embraced it uncritically. Is it like football where we all sucked an orange and swapped sides?

I’m certainly willing to mock Tory inconsistancy over free trade but I seem to have missed the memo when the Left embraced it uncritically.

See ‘New Labour’ as led by Blair (1994-2007) and Brown (2007 – ?) – with a bit of help from Mandelson – but then again they aren’t ‘the Left’.

If the moon fell from the sky tonight The Tory party would claim it is all Briowns fault.

Funny, I don’t remember Gordon Brown getting on a plane and flying to America every Monday morning for the last 5 years, and then running Leman Brothers, Merrill Lynch, Aig etc etc. I don’t remember him working for the American credit agency’s which decided how much should be leant to sub prime borrowers.

I also don’t remember him then flying back to the UK, and sitting in the boardrooms of Northern Rock, HBOS, and Bradford and Bingley and destroying their business.

But then this is classic businessman for you. Fuck up their own industries, and then blame everybody else for their own idiocy and Greed. The MS media seem to have airbrushed out of history the fact that Cameron was calling for more Banking deregulation about 2 years ago, so British banks would become more like American ones.

I know Labour aren’t the Left but I hadn’t realised Sunny had defected too. He’s quite sensible on most subjects.

By the way, that orange-sucking bit was a football reference, not a snide comment on autoerotic asphyxiation and I apologise if I have offended any Tories reading this, especially now they have rejected free-market fundamentalism.

What with the new-found commitment to civil rights I’m just glad the Labour Party are bringing in ID cards to remind me who I am.

I know Labour aren’t the Left but I hadn’t realised Sunny had defected too.

I haven’t. I’m just pointing out that right now Osborne makes about as much sense on our economy as an Australian koala bear. And he looks like one too.

I thought you were probably still one of us.

I still think we should be happy if the Tories are prepared to question the market, no matter how incoherantly, because there’s still the slight chance that Labour might get confused and try to outflank the Tories on the Left. At the very least its a stick to beat Brown with.

if the Tories are prepared to question the market, no matter how incoherantly, because there’s still the slight chance that Labour might get confused and try to outflank the Tories on the Left.

I wonder why it is I often feel a distinct sense of ennui whenever I consider contemporary British politics…

New Labour have never understood markets , how would they , none of them have ever sold anything , or indeed played any role in wealth creation. Conservatives do not have to question the because for them they were never disembodied ideological totems in the first place . They are real messy , easy to subvert and full of individuals who get up every morning determined to cheat . Regulation is essential of course and but in any case commerce itself ante dates amd ermges fromcivil society and trust . I don’t think its reasonable to say Brown should have foreseen this minor perturbation he is whining about . Not to prepare however is like going on an English holiday without an Anorak.
I can hear him now
“ Niver in all hoomaarnitez recorded history harz it rained. This unprecedented rain means the wurld shood bay me arn anorak “.

Or you might not have run up debts when you should have been paying them down , and you should not have built in colossal Public sector drag we could not afford unless it never rained .
No more boom and bust .Genius . 40% over an economic cycle , what cycle is that brownie boy the thousand years cycle ? I dread to think what his under pants look like when they get out of the wash , “Poot it orn the fafty yar cycle wooman “ That is if any of them are not yet on fire .

What a clown , I ‘m starting to enjoy him actually , oo did you hear he made 100,000 jobs for us , yes he did , he made them in the little jobbies factory at the bottom of his garden with the fairies . That’s lovely Gordon what will you make with your magic wand now ? Tell the children …….

The fact is they can’t do anything anyway, and as the Opposition they are within their rights to criticise Government strategy if they believe it to be detrimental to the economy

I think you’ve missed the point of the line of attack. It’s pointing out that the Tories don’t appear to have any real policies other than say anything to grab headlines attacking the government. They’re not providing a coherent alternative. Their slip in the polls can be argued demonstrates that point amply.

I’m just pointing out that right now Osborne makes about as much sense on our economy as an Australian koala bear. And he looks like one too.

I think that’s quite literally one of the funniest things I’ve seen you write!

Actually I’d say it’s not just the conservatives who are failing to provide an alternative, the entire political establishment is completely clueless as to what to do. Bringing back Keynes has been the best they can come up with, without attempting to address some of the flaws that led to Keynes being abandoned in the first place.

The problem has been the political establishment has become so ideologically homogenous (economically speaking) that visions of a future economy have been excluded from mainstream political debate for so long (Indeed what passes as political debate between Labour and the Conservatives has been a joke for years, if not decades). There are some great ideas for reform and building a new economy out there, but they have tended to be advocated by people or groups outside the three parties, and indeed have largely come to the field of economic policy via routes like environmental science. But the main Political Parties have been a major barrier towards good policy for so long that I don’t hold much hope of policy becoming sane, ambitious and successful for a while.

The boy George is not confused. He is a strategic genius.

For example, few would have realised that bringing Ken Clarke back to shadow Peter Mandelson, (because of Dave’s worries about how Gideon, the wallpaper heir, is playing with the voter) was in fact George’s own brilliant idea all along.

Must be true: it is in tomorrow’s Telegraph.

In unrelated news, I seem to have a very itchy chin.

(More childishness on this here)
http://www.nextleft.org/2009/01/boy-george-ken-clarke-and-jimmy-hill.html

The Tory policy is not “do nothing”, it’s just do something different to what Labour are proposing.

See here – http://theorator2009.blogspot.com/2009/01/what-i-dont-get-about-browns-stimulus.html

Of course if one is only quoting from the NuLabour Talking Points Memo then one will ignore this fact.

planeshift:
Actually I’d say it’s not just the conservatives who are failing to provide an alternative, the entire political establishment is completely clueless as to what to do. Bringing back Keynes has been the best they can come up with, without attempting to address some of the flaws that led to Keynes being abandoned in the first place.

I agree with that. I think we should spend more time on that this year trying to think of where this should go. If the political establishment can’t do it… why can’t we?

Orator – the infrastructure goes to the heart of Osborne’s fumble.

This country cannot export anything or create any new jobs unless it invests in new industries. So Osborne can’t legitimately complain about our Chinese fuelled consumption boom unless he plans to invest in infrastructure here himself… or at least push some industries. The last few decades have shown that in fact manufacturing in contracting and going overseas. How does he plan to counteract that?

Tsk tsk Sunny surely you are not suggesting ( for it would be quite right ) that in addition to saddling us with a swollen public sector debt mountain in ten years of boom New Labour have failed to invest in infra structure ? No !The only real answer is to reduce taxes fund the reduction with cuts but that’s a bit tricky thanks the Brown land

Brown land is a gloriously happy place which , like the world of Harry Potter , lives alongside the real world .Here no-one is ever fired , no-one goes out of business , pensions are final salary and recruitment continues right now faster than ever . You enter this state within a state by reading the Guardian and answering one of their scented invitations you to liase with community interface committees .
There ,sipping nectarand slipping your un roughened palm languorously into the ambrosial streams of taxes your life is an earthly paradise lacking only a good supply of tractable virgins
Wonka made such a world for his umpa lumpas . Oddly enough Wonka is almost exactly how I habitually refer to Gordon Brown.

Thats your problem

( Anyone know how to stop a smoke alarm going off all night ?)

“( Anyone know how to stop a smoke alarm going off all night ?)”

Put the fire out.

“I think you’ve missed the point of the line of attack. It’s pointing out that the Tories don’t appear to have any real policies other than say anything to grab headlines attacking the government. They’re not providing a coherent alternative. Their slip in the polls can be argued demonstrates that point amply.”

Yes, this is how the New Labour propaganda machine is trying to spin the news and its readily taken up the “useful idiot” Tory haters on blogs and in the Media. However, the truth is the Tories are offering an alternative to prolonged unmanageable debt, initiatives to help small businesses, initiatives to help savers and the low paid, initiatives to stimulate business lending, they want to simplify the present complicated, bureaucratic tax system that penalises and disincentives the poorest, they attacked the waste of £12.5bn, temporary VAT rate cut and have been proven right. Their message is proper and effective regulation, not more regulation. They have supported the Govt.s actions where they believe they are acting in the country’s best interest, e.g. the Bank bail out. They have correctly exposed the mishandling of the economy that has undoubtedly worsened the recession and the housing crisis. They have exposed Brown’s ineffective management of the FSA.

Grabbing headlines is not easy for the Tories. They are competing with the biggest propaganda machine in Europe, a Media that mostly ranges from the hostile to the cynical and one that contains too many unprincipled hacks prepared to drink milk from New Labour’s tits.

“There are some great ideas for reform and building a new economy out there”

Such as?

“This country cannot export anything or create any new jobs unless it invests in new industries. So Osborne can’t legitimately complain about our Chinese fuelled consumption boom unless he plans to invest in infrastructure here himself… or at least push some industries. The last few decades have shown that in fact manufacturing in contracting and going overseas. How does he plan to counteract that?”

By supporting and encouraging small businesses, as opposed to Labour who have removed corporation tax relief for the smallest (often start-up) businesses.

You are correct to highlight the decline of manufacturing which has declined at a rate as bad as the time of major restructuring under Thatcher. So despite, their rhetoric on the loss of our industrial employment under the Tories, they have done nothing. Osbourne does not criticise the consumption of Chinese goods, he merely describes what happens. He does not expand on the point, as he should do. This allows you to submit your own interpretation.

I agree the Tories should set an agenda about fuelling our industries and show some national self-interest (and tell the EU to FO).