What might a 21st century Libel Law look like?


1:15 pm - October 14th 2009

by Unity    


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I don’t usually do requests, but as libel law reform is a particular interest of mine and a subject I’ve blogged on previous occasions, I’m more than happy to rise to the challenge set by ‘organic cheeseboard’ in comments under Sunder’s commentary on yesterday’s events.

but for god’s sake could SOMEONE writing about this stuff PLEASE offer an idea of what those reforms might actually look like?

Fair enough, lets start with an internet specific reform which, as a blogger, is number one on my own shopping list of reforms, and a measure that we absolutely do want to import from our cousins over the the other side of the Big Pond.

Section 230 of the Communications Decency Acy specifies simply that:

No provider or user of an interactive computer service shall be treated as the publisher or speaker of any information provided by another information content provider.

Under English libel law, at present, web hosting companies may treated as the publisher of, and held liable for, [allegedly] defamatory content published to their servers by a third party despite having had no absolutely part in in, or prior knowledge, of the that material’s publication. Likewise, bloggers and forum operators can be sued over comments, posted to their blog/forum  by visitors, over which they will have had no control whatsoever unless they actively pre-moderate all such comments.

There’s a basic issue of fairness here.

Why should I (or Dave Osler, for that matter) face the rap, and a phenomenally expensive and time consuming High Court action, as a result of material posted to my blog by a visitor with my express knowledge, particularly if I then behave entirely responsibly by removing the allegedly defamatory material with n a reasonable amount of time after being made aware of its existence?

That’s the exact situation that Dave finds himself in at the moment, one that simply could not arise in the US.

There is also a second important issue here.

By treating web hosts as the publishers of material uploaded to their servers by third parties, the law as it stands encourages would be litigants to bypass the due legal process entirely by threatening to sue the hosting company, which will almost always prompt the company to roll over and take matters into its own hands irrespective of the views/intentions of the blogger/forum owner to whom such a threat directly relates.

That’s what happened to Craig Murray and, by extension to Tim Ireland, Boris Johnson and Bob Piper.

Craig was perfectly content to stand his ground and defend what he had to say about Russian/Uzbek oligarch Alisher Usmanov in court, going so far as to specifically invite a libel action to put his comments to the test. That rigfht was, however, temporarily taken entirely out of his hands by the company that hosted his blog, which rolled over when threatened by Usmanov’s lawyers, Schillings.

Again, that cannot happen in the US, and its the main reason why I and many other bloggers choose to host our sites with American providers on US-based servers. It doesn’t prevent us from being sued for defamation, but it does stop would-be litigants trying to short-circuit the due legal process by threatening the hosting company, leaving the decision as to whether to stand and fight, or back down, in my hands and those of someone who has no effective means of accurately assessing the situation.

This has been under discussion for while amongst established bloggers from all parts of the political spectrum and its fair to say, having been part of those discussions. that there’s a clear consensus that we need provisions similar to those enjoyed by bloggers in the US. If blogging is to continue to be an interactive medium then, at the very least, web hosting companies should be afforded the same ‘common carrier’ status enjoyed by providers of telephone services, removing entirely their current liability for content housed on their servers, while bloggers and forum owners need provisions which limit their potential liability for third party comments to situations in which they fail to act responsibly when faced with a complaint that a comment may be [allegedly] defamatory, i.e. removal of such a comment within a reasonable amount time after receiving such a complaint should be sufficient to preclude any further action.

Target number two for urgent reform is the abominable multiple publication rule, which provides the foundations for England’s rapidly expanding libel tourism industry.

To save time, the background to this aspect of English libel law and the issues it raises are discussed here by Peter Noorlander. It is, however, worth noting that this rule has become so pernicious that, so far, the states of New York, Florida and California have enacted laws rendering High Court libel judgements based on this rule unenforceable in those states, and that a Federal law to the same effect may soon follow.

Thankfully, the days of the multiple publication rule (and libel tourism) may well be numbers as the Ministry of Justice is currently consulting on possible reforms, with the favoured reform option looking likely to be a single publication rule with an extension to the time limit within which a libel action may generally be brought to three years and an absolute limit of ten year.

In the circumstances, our best option at this time would clearly appear to be to support and, if possible, contribute to the MoJ’s consultation by supporting the proposal to do away with the multiple publication rule.

From there we need next to focus on the workings of two important legal principles within the framework of English defamation law, those of  absolute and qualified privilege and malice both of which, if formulated well and applied in a nuanced and judicious manner, would allow us to afford a greater degree of protection to certain important types of speech without tipping English defamation law towards the kind of ‘free for all’ that exists in the United States in which public figures, in particular, have almost no possibility of obtaining redress even if what is written about them is verifiable a complete fabrication.

In comments, ‘organic cheeseboard’ makes the following observation:

Nick Cohen, who writes the ratbiter pieces in private eye and who thinks we should copy the American laws verbatim (not that he ever says that in the Eye pieces, natch).

Now, I think that’s a really bad idea, given the state of the US news industry and the extent to which smears dominate political reporting and campaigning over there.

And, broadly speaking, I’m inclined to agree, although I’m much less concerned about the issue of political smears, which could more readily be dealt with in electoral law, than I am about the proliferation of the made-up celebrity tittle-tattle industry, which is getting bad enough over here as things currently stand.

In the US, public figures have to prove malice in order to mount a libel action against a publisher (in English law, malice is only a factor in determining damages) and this has created a gaping loophole in their defamation law in which an entire industry based on spreading made-up celebrity ‘gossip’ has flourished.

I recent read an article in which a journalist who’d worked on one of these downmarket gossip rags, the kind that invariably feature either Jennifer Aniston, Brad Pitt or Angelina Jolie on the cover every simgle week, blew the lid on the ‘journalistic’ methods by which they generate the constant stream of banal fictions on which their sales figure entirely depend, the short version of which being that they routinely buy in every paparazzi shot they can get hold of, pick out one that shows Brad/Angelina/Jennifer in a particular ‘mood’ and then make if a story to go with the photo. If Jennifer’s looking happy then, in made-up gossip world, things must be going well with her current boyfriend, or there’s a new man on the horizon or whatever, if she looks a bit pissed off then her relationship must be on the rock or she must still be pining for Brad. The real trick in all this is that today’s paps use high-speed digital cameras which can reel off tens, and even, hundreds of shots in rapid succession with the result that a couple of minutes worth of frantic snapping will give the magazine just about every possible ‘mood’ they could ever work with.

As I see it, what we need to be looking for is a framework in which the principles of absolute and qualified privilege and malice are balanced in a such a way as to ‘raise the bar’ on defamation actions relating to certain types of speech which we consider to be necessary and/or desirable in an open, democratic society.

This is view that I know will prove a bit controversial with some Lib Dem bloggers who debated this issue following Richard Dawkin’s appearance at their recent conference and who came down strongly against the idea that some type of speech should be regarded as being ‘more equal’ than other.

Personally, I take the view that there are certain type of speech to which a greater degree of protection from suppressive or censorious litigation should be afford, over and above the general protections given to all forms of speech.

Political speech, including criticism of politicians and public officials, which is absolutely necessary in a democracy, is one such category and one that the European Court of Human Rights already recognises as meriting an enhanced degree of legal protection. Whistleblowing is another, as-  to my mind – is scientific ‘speech’ founded on evidence. Libel hearings are no place to resolve disputes over the merits, or otherwise, of claims which purport to be based on scientific evidence. This brief list is not exhaustive, nor intended to be so, but it does give a flavour of the kind of speech that we should by ‘hardening’ against private censorship founded on the abuse of defamation law because its in our interests, as a free and democratic society, to encourage and facilitate speech of this kind as a matter of public good.

Finally we come to matters of process at trial, in which those defending a libel action are unduly and unfairly burdened with presumptions that may have seemed reasonable in the 18th Century but which have should have no place in a 21st century courtroom.

The most notorious of these is, of course, the presumption that an allegedly defamatory statement is untrue unless proven otherwise by the defendant in circumstances in which the plaintiff need provide no evidence whatsoever to support their claim that the statement is untrue. Such a presumption may have suited the social mores of a society in which a gentleman was automatically though to be a man of honour but in this day and age such archaic and overly romantic notions can hardly be held to remain valid. That absolute presumption has to go.

In other forms of civil action, no such automatic presumption is made. Instead, at any given time, each party is obligated to produce evidence relating to their claim/defence (called the burden of going forward) which, if it gives rise to presumption of fact, places the burden of going forward onto the opposing party who may, then, introduce evidence to rebut that presumption. If the presumption is adequately rebutted then it ‘bursts’ (hence this is called the ‘bursting bubble’ approach) and that presumption can no longer be relied on.

That process, which does not rely on any absolute presumption at the outset, does not seem, to me at least, to unreasonably shift the advantage in libel actions towards the defendant, in seems only to place both parties on a more equitable inasmuch as both will be required, at various times, to produce evidence to support their case. In fact it may, in practice, have little or no impact on the prospects of those defending a libel action, at all, but it would remove the clear perception that such actions are loaded unfairly in favour of plaintiffs.

Beyond that, the presumption of damage, i.e. that a defamatory statement is automatically damaging, except where it can be shown that the plaintiff has no reputation to defend, also needs to revised such that the plaintiff must produce evidence to show both that their reputation and standing has suffered actual damage as a consequence of a defamatory statement and where compensation is sought in relation to such a claim, that, evidence of a material of loss is produced.

So that’s four areas in which reforms are needed;

One – ‘common carrier status’ – that should be easy to effect but which, sadly, is likely to meet considerable resistance from politicians given their overweening interest in forced ISP’s to police the Internet – I’m reliably informed that the ‘benefits’ of Chinese-style universal fire-walling was a hot topic of interest amongst some Tory MPs at their conference.

Two – changes to the multiple publication rule – that’s currently in the pipeline and needing support, and

Three – adjustments to the rules of privilege, malice and the procedure rules covering presumptions in libel actions, that need careful thought and better legal minds than this layman can offer to work up the details.

Now, what was Sunder saying about needing an effective campaign?

Oh, and support Dave Osler – that’s really important right now!

UPDATE

Apropos one ongoing libel case, Jack of Kent has just advised (by Twitter) that Simon Singh has been granted leave to appeal Justice Eady’s perverse ruling on the meaning of his comments on the BCA’s evidence and that this will be a full appeal, allowing Simon to reargue this point in its entirety!

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About the author
'Unity' is a regular contributor to Liberal Conspiracy. He also blogs at Ministry of Truth.
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Story Filed Under: Blog ,Civil liberties ,Our democracy ,Reform

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Reader comments


1. organic cheeseboard

thank you.

In the US, public figures have to prove malice in order to mount a libel action against a publisher (in English law, malice is only a factor in determining damages) and this has created a gaping loophole in their defamation law in which an entire industry based on spreading made-up celebrity ‘gossip’ has flourished.

Not sure I agree with your point, or Organic Cheeseboard’s point, here. Companies being able to stop investigative journalists from collecting and publishing evidence of their wrongdoing is obviously a problem, and one that urgently needs resolving.

But I’m struggling to work out why supermarket tabloids being able to publish, non-malicious, daft nonsense about celebrities should be seen as a problem at all. It’s a game; the celebrities and publishers are both playing it for money; the readers are playing it for amusement; and nobody believes it’s anything else…

So as far as I’m concerned, a US rule where publishing whatever you want about companies and celebrities is fine unless malicious (but publishing nonsense obviously gets you the reputation as a comic rather than a newspaper), but publishing falsehoods about private individuals is treated as seriously as it is now, doesn’t have any drawbacks.

One libel reform I would like to see is that where a newspaper had written a deliberately untrue story and lost the libel action, instead of just having a monetary award against them (which is usually a few hours’ profit for the likes of News International, i.e. well worth it so long as the lie raised sales a bit) they should be compelled to give the same space in their newspaper to the victim to write whatever they liked.

There is another issue of course, which is newspapers telling deliberate and outrageous lies, often on their front page, which are carefully written to avoid libelling any individual person, leaving no recourse at all.

Perhaps time for a collective libel law to stop lies being told about groups like asylum seekers? Ok, so I’m not being entirely serious, but it would be nice if we could find any kind of solution to what seems like a far bigger problem than celebrity tittle tattle, however odious that may be…

John:

The point I’m driving at there, which maybe I’ve not expressed very well, is that if we’re going to make adjustments to the manner in which privilege and malice are applied in English libel law, starting from where we are now, then I can see no compelling reason for framing those adjustments in a way that would benefit the likes of Bella or Heat.

In short, fuck ’em and let them take their chances with the law pretty much as it stands, because it really is no skin off my nose if they get sued for making up stories about slebs having hissy fits and fuck knows what else.

They’re not important – protecting political speech, whistleblowing and scientific debate are.

5. Shatterface

‘Political speech, including criticism of politicians and public officials, which is absolutely necessary in a democracy, is one such category and one that the European Court of Human Rights already recognises as meriting an enhanced degree of legal protection. Whistleblowing is another, as-  to my mind – is scientific ’speech’ founded on evidence. Libel hearings are no place to resolve disputes over the merits, or otherwise, of claims which purport to be based on scientific evidence.’

Add in a protection for blasphemy too, potentially as important in the 21st Century as the freedom to criticise politics or make scientific judgement, as they increasingly conflict or interact.

As I said, that list is not exhaustive, so I welcome any suggestions for addition together with debate on the principle that some forms of speech are actually deserving of greater protection as a matter of public good.

@3, OK I see where you’re coming from, but I think it’s dangerous – a lot of the really bad stuff that’s crept in over the last few years stems from the adaptation of privacy law, derived from sleb cases, to proper-news cases.

If it’s possible for Carter-Ruck to claim that a given whistleblowing/political/scientific case has *elements* that fall under your tittle-tattle exemption, then they’ll exploit that. Much safer to say “no, Bella doesn’t deserve protection, but nor does Posh Spice, and society is far better off if we unjustly protect Bella while defending Private Eye than if we unjustly protect Posh Spice while defending, erm, nobody” (because the rules would still be as-now for non-public figures).

8. Shatterface

‘As I said, that list is not exhaustive, so I welcome any suggestions for addition together with debate on the principle that some forms of speech are actually deserving of greater protection as a matter of public good.’

Listening to a debate on Mill yesterday (I don’t make a habit of it) I heard his argument that behaviour deemed to be offensive if performed in public, and therefore subject to sanction, should be permissable in private to allow for experiment in life styles or some such; this could be a defence of statements made in private but leaked into the public sphere.

A right to privacy, and to argue freely before presenting conclusions in public, or just to gossip, should be maintained.

@6

If you look at how the US approach to malice has evolved its actually gone in the opposite direction to the evolution of privacy in the UK inasmuch as it stems from the idea that a free press has a role in the democratic process and should be free to criticise politicians and public officials and then extended outward to encompass public figures in general and, today, to cover private individuals who temporarily become public figure by virtue of their involvement in newsworthy events.

What there is there is an interesting interplay between free speech, privacy and the public interest, which is where all the nuances will lie.

As I see it, there is a public interest test to be applied here on the basis of which the need to demonstrate malice may or may not come into play.

If there’s no legitimate public interest in the matter at hand, then there would be no need to show malice before proceeding with the action.

If there is, then the plaintiff would also need to show malice, or that defendant had acted in bad faith, i.e. in the knowledge that the defamatory material was untrue or a work of fiction, in order to proceed with the action in full, the test of which would, I suspect, need to be one of reasonable belief so as not to be unduly proscriptive and unbalanced towards the defendant.

A right to privacy, and to argue freely before presenting conclusions in public, or just to gossip, should be maintained.

Of course – the purpose of defamation law is not to regulate private conduct and, as such, private conversations would continues to be treated as privileged and not actionable.

What may need some thought, at the judicial end of things, is how that principle applies to e-mails which can readily be sent to multiple recipients but still be consider, by both the sender and recipients, to amount to a private conversation.

@8, agreed, but I think the US has the right balance between privacy and the public interest, and that any protection to free speech weaker than that in the US will inevitably be exploited by Carter Ruck-ists defending crooked oligarchs and corrupt companies.

And I’m struggling to see any examples from the US where their libel system has led to actual, real-world, negative consequences for anyone, beyond being accused of being happy/sad/dopey/grumpy/Doc by a gossip rag.

Nice article. The other (complementary) approach is working through the courts, to challenge the scope of injunctions and the ease with which they are granted.

The Norwegian broadcaster NRK has been an unsung hero in all of this, able to put online both the Minton report and the original injunction against the Guardian. Why could they do that? Because, a few years ago, NRK broke an injunction, defended itself in court, and so set a precedent making it much harder to get anti-publication injunctions in Norway. As one of their lawyers writes:

Although, of course, violating an injunction is generally a criminal offence, as NRKs counsel I argued that a) the injunction was itself a violation of the ECHR article 10, and that b), if the courts agreed on that point, punishing the editor for violating the injunction, would be yet a violation of ECHR article 10…. Our case was successful, and as a general legal consequence, today it is virtually impossible to succeed in an application for an injunction against the media. Lesson: A little “civil disobedience” could maybe rid British media law of the injunction-censorship-monster…

But I’m struggling to work out why supermarket tabloids being able to publish, non-malicious, daft nonsense about celebrities should be seen as a problem at all.

Think of Borges’s Library of babel, which contains, somewhere ‘ every coherent book ever written, or that might ever be written, and every possible permutation or slightly erroneous version of every one of those books’.

In other words, it contains nothing useful: zero information.

The same applies to public information without some form of quality control, a function currently partially handled by the libel system.

Say of the seven companies in a field, one was significantly less ethical then the other six, and wanted to conceal that fact (if only form the investors it was planning to rip off). Currently, it would do that by keeping it’s shadiest dealing on the down-low, and engaging one of those law firms with names out of a cyberpunk novel to prosecute whistle-blowers.

With no libel laws (or equivalent replacement), what it could do instead is plant fake stories about each of it’s’ six competitors. This has the same net effect – it gets seen as no worse or better than anyone else. With corporate backing for a a marketing department making up smears, they are likely to be far more well-documented and convincing than anything a whistelblower can come up with.

If 99.9% of stories about dumping toxic waste or exploiting child labour were basically marketing gimmicks, they would all be equally ignored. Any whistleblower would be silenced more effectively than by any firewall or lawsuit: anyone can hear what they say, just no-one believes it.

@12
That only works if you assume newspapers have no interest in cultivating a reputation for printing the truth. Which probably applies for supermarket comics, but not plausibly at FT/WSJ, or even Gruaniad/Times, level.

The Internet is a good analogy there: yes, it’s a Library of Babel, but it’s also ranked and indexed by credibility. So you can read insane conspiracy theories about more or less anything online, but if you’re looking for accuracy rather than amusement you can also very easily filter down to the ones reported by credible media outlets. Sites that report loony things lose their reputations as credible media outlets, and Ranting Bob’s Crazy Site Of Lies shows up as hit number 50,000 on Google.

(see also: how the current libel laws do absolutely nothing against tabloids printing sleb lies)

With regard to the burden of proof, it is extremely hard to prove that something isn’t true. Let’s say for example that the Daily Beast runs a story that the right hon A N Other MP has been taking bribes from corrupt Russian oillmen. How is the MP to prove that he hasn’t? Proving negatives is almost impossible.

It does not strike me as particularly unreasonable that if you make defamatory statements about somebody that you should have to demonstrate their truth.

Likewise wrt the presumption of damage. It is already the case that the claimant has to demonstrate damage, unlesss the statement was of a type that is presumed automatically to be damaging – like allegation of a crime for example. The example everybody knows is Berkov v Burchill – is being called hideously ugly defamatory? No, because no damagesos caused to reputation.

I agree with the need to reform the multiple publications rule, especially wrt t’interwebs. I think legislating to make lying illegal might prove a touch problematic though…

@13: if you look at the actors currently immune to libel laws (states, mainly), it’s pretty clear they can quite successfully game journalists into printing pretty much whatever they want.

I don’t see where they are going to get the extra capacity to sort through a vastly greater quantity of lies from more sources. And even if one or two succeeded, they wouldn’t get any real reputation benefits from doing so, because all the competing newspapers would just run bogus stories about how they lied anyway.

(See just about every Mail and Times stories on the BBC ever).

18. Sunder Katwala

Thanks. I look forward to digesting it properly.

I think the post helps to clarify that we could do with.
– Broad principles/objectives of reform which might command consensus
– Specific proposals (such as these) which meet these by particular responses to problems in the current system

There is no doubt that the issues will be contested, including some regressive moves. (Newsnight last night included a lawyer questioning Parliamentary privilege as a response to yesterday’s events!)

One part of that challenge is that the internet discussion will (compared to say mainstream media; legal; parliamentary) tend to be
– broader
– more libertarian
– more internet-focused (which is a good idea; there are emerging problems).

I think we lack forums for the type of political negotiation between types of perspective, which might help to prioritise and establish key messages about what should change much more concretely than is now the case.

My thought is that if more people tried to do what you have done here and put up “three changes I would like to see” we could try to develop a sense of how far liberal ngo, media, legal, political and blogosphere voices might agree on some points of consensus about reform/campaigning priorities, even while not agreeing on everything, and indeed agree on strategic/tactical/process points about how to pursue reform in practice.

I could imagine the Liberal Democrats in particular becoming one good site of engaged debate about tensions and trade-offs, where some of the liberal/libertarian and more ‘establishment’ liberal political/legal voices might engage over the details, though I acknowledge there are lots of centre-right and libertarian voices involved in this too.

And I would like to see some of us in the Labour Party get our party on the right side of a major civil liberties issue too!

19. Shatterface

‘It does not strike me as particularly unreasonable that if you make defamatory statements about somebody that you should have to demonstrate their truth.’

Or at least that there is sufficient evidence that a reasonable person could have believe there is a case to answer, but this brings us a long way from ‘proof’ in a legal sense because ‘sufficient evidence’, ‘reasonable person’ and ‘case to answer’ are so vague there will never be an agreement on what they mean.

Personally I find celebrity gossip vaguely repellant but that’s just personal distaste, not principle; on this, and a preference for real ale, I’m a snob. I’m not sure it should be a matter for the state.

20. sanbikinoraion

Of course – the purpose of defamation law is not to regulate private conduct and, as such, private conversations would continues to be treated as privileged and not actionable.

Depends on the ‘private conversation’, doesn’t it? Private conversations by email are still considered ‘publishing’ from the point of view of libel, which seems like another problem with current libel law.

21. Bryan Chalmers

One other item that needs to be reformed is the cost of defending an action.

Currently, people are bullied by the ridiculously high costs that are involved and will cave in to this pressure even if they have a good case to present.

My thoughts. In short: capping all costs awards at legal aid rates would be a bloody good start (and indeed, not just in libel law: it’d be a very nice, drawback-free piece of tort law reform).

Mmm… well yes, the cost issue is an important but slightly separate area which is ripe for reform, and pegging cost awards to legal aid rates is a damn good starting point to work from.

On the costs front, I think there’s also scope for exploring the idea of a small claims tribunal and an arbitration scheme, both of which would prove attractive to local/regional newspapers where the costs of a basic high court action are typically out of all proportion to the damages sought.

And, actually, we might have fewer libel actions against newspapers if the PCC weren’t such a bunch of ineffective tosspots.

24. Shatterface

Good news for Simon Singh, anyway: Judge Eady’s preliminary ruling against him has been overturned.

25. Richard Gadsden

I think the better response to sleb nonsense is to professionalise journalism; if the sleb could appeal to a General Jounalism Council to get the journo struck off for printing a story they hadn’t done any checking on then that would deal with the low standards of slbe stories without having any effect on serious journalism.

Struck-off journalists would still be able to publish whatever they wanted, just (probably) not in a newspaper. Make journalist a protected title (like doctor or engineer) while you’re at it,

26. Dan Hardie

I don’t like the ‘bubble bursting’ principle at all. I’d support a stronger basis in law for the ‘Reynolds defence’: roughly speaking, that writers or publishers aren’t guilty of libel if they made a rigorous attempt to investigate a matter, including putting any defamatory accusations to the person or persons involved and asking for their response, and came to a reasonable conclusion on the basis of all the available evidence.

As things stand, the Reynolds defence has been accepted as a possible defence against libel by the Court of Appeal- which helpfully even spelled out the steps a publication would have to take to successfully use such a defence. Unsurprisingly, the British courts have yet to accept that any publication has actually published a story covered by the Reynolds defence, so the protection it offers is theoretical rather than real.

‘Bubble bursting’ would mean that a (well-funded) newspaper could print unpleasant allegations against someone with less resources, and the defamed person would then face having to prove a negative in an expensive court action. A ‘Reynolds defence’ would commit the newspaper to thoroughly investigating the allegations first, including privately asking the person accused what they had to say: not perfect, but much more likely to protect the rights both of publishers and of genuinely libelled people.

27. douglas clark

Unity,

Excellent article.

Ré your comment at 25. Would you see a small claims tribual as the starting point for all libel actions, with no exceptions? For that would be useful in trivialising the imbalance that the powerful appear to have, without necessarily denying remedy.

28. Matt Wardman

How do you frame the protection of scientific debate points?

Bearing in mind the Singh case (i.e., pseudo-science), but also that established “scientific” theories have been simply wrong, and that derided theories have been right (e.g., Plate Tectonics).

29. douglas clark

Matt Wardman,

If the legal profession can invent super injunctions, it cannot be beyond the wit of man to develop super protections.

I have to be careful here, but attacking the British Woo Society and saying they are full of shit, should not, it seems to me to be legitimately actionable unless you take the truly oddly entrenched legalistic view that a group is an individual, with rights, etc.

Attacking an individual member of the British Woo Society and saying that Mr X is full of shit should be subject to individual action and be open to defences of ‘fair comment’ and ECHR Article 10. ‘Course Mr X might be right and this would come out in a judgement….

Mr Singh seems to me to have run up against this idea that an abstract is a real person.

And, frankly a Court of Law nor, dare I say it, a web site, is anywhere worth trying to resolve scientific debates.

Dan:

I think you misunderstand the point about ‘bubble bursting’, which is fair enough as its a pretty technical point.

To clarify, the Reynolds defence is effectively a claim of qualified privilege based on a ten point test set out by Lord Nicholls in the House of Lords ruling in Reynolds vs Times Newspapers Ltd.

The bubble bursting principle applies to the trial process and to the establishment of fact relevant to the case, so…

If a newspaper is sued for libel buts seeks to deploy the Reynolds defence then, at either trial or, more commonly, at a preliminary hearing, the newspaper will present evidence to the court in an effort to establish, as a matter of fact, that it complied with each of the ten points of the test and is, therefore, entitled to qualified privilege.

Once the evidence is presented, the plaintiff is afforded the opportunity to provide their own evidence in rebuttal of the evidence provided by the newspaper.

If the newspaper successfully establishes that complied with the ten point of the test, then it is a matter of fact that they published under qualified privilege. If, however, it fails on any point of the test then the bubble burst and that defence is not open to them.

The bubble bursting principle is not alternative to the Reynolds defence, which should actually be strengthened by incorporating it into statute, its merely part of the process by which the defence is established, or not, according to the facts of the case.

How do you frame the protection of scientific debate points?

With a two part test.

In the first instance scientific debate is unequivocally in the public interest and, as such, if its established that the allegedly defamatory speech forms part of such a debate then the plaintiff will have to demonstrate evidence of malice in order to mount a case.

In the second instance, a test broadly similar to that of the Reynolds defence would be made available to defendants which, if successfully argued, would afford them the protection of qualified privilege.

As for what that test might look like, some elements that would be part of the test, as I see it, would be derived from the Daubert Standard, which is discussed here – http://www.ministryoftruth.me.uk/2009/10/15/simon-singh-and-the-daubert-standard/ – in the context of its potential relevance to Simon Singh’s case.


Reactions: Twitter, blogs
  1. Sunder Katwala

    engaged #CarterRuck libel reform/what next responses @libcon in threads http://tinyurl.com/yhtgunk and http://tiny.cc/ZNLfp

  2. kobbie

    RT @politicsofuk British libel laws are a mess. So, what might a 21st century libel law look like? #ukpolitics http://bit.ly/16DmsW

  3. Sunder Katwala

    engaged #CarterRuck libel reform/what next responses @libcon in threads http://tinyurl.com/yhtgunk and http://tiny.cc/ZNLfp

  4. » ‘english celebrities’ on the web Kates Objective Opinion

    […] https://liberalconspiracy.org/2009/10/14/what-might-a-21st-century-libel-law-look-like/… a publisher (in English law, malice is only a factor in determining damages) and this has created a gaping loophole in their defamation law in which an entire industry based on spreading made-up celebrity ‘gossip’ has flourished. … […]

  5. kobbie

    RT @politicsofuk British libel laws are a mess. So, what might a 21st century libel law look like? #ukpolitics http://bit.ly/16DmsW

  6. Tweets that mention Liberal Conspiracy » What might a 21st century Libel Law look like? -- Topsy.com

    […] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Sunder Katwala, kobbie. kobbie said: RT @politicsofuk British libel laws are a mess. So, what might a 21st century libel law look like? #ukpolitics http://bit.ly/16DmsW […]

  7. Brroha

    Liberal Conspiracy » What might a 21st century Libel Law look like?: Under English libel law, at present, web h.. http://bit.ly/1CZqRj

  8. Chad Van Norman

    Liberal Conspiracy » What might a 21st century Libel Law look like? http://bit.ly/lLvGY
    By: http://www.GoGVOCom.com

  9. JasonG

    Liberal Conspiracy » What might a 21st century Libel Law look like? http://bit.ly/3NI6wp

  10. Pablo Montalvo

    Liberal Conspiracy » What might a 21st century Libel Law look like? http://bit.ly/4FGj32

  11. Brroha

    Liberal Conspiracy » What might a 21st century Libel Law look like?: Under English libel law, at present, web h.. http://bit.ly/1CZqRj

  12. Chad Van Norman

    Liberal Conspiracy » What might a 21st century Libel Law look like? http://bit.ly/lLvGY
    By: http://www.GoGVOCom.com

  13. JasonG

    Liberal Conspiracy » What might a 21st century Libel Law look like? http://bit.ly/3NI6wp





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