I once heard Sinn Fein’s Mitchel McLoughlin state in a meeting at the HOC, that not every Catholic is a republican or nationalist or every Protestant a unionist. It was up to the politcal parties of NI to reach out to all the peoples of the province.

Sadly, despite the progress made since the Good Friday agreement parties in NI are still heavily divided on sectarian lines. Perhaps it’s time Labour came out behind the shadows of the SDLP and gave a voice to those whose views are left-of-centre and focus on economic realities and life-opportunities for all the people of Northern Ireland, especially the young unemployed.

Q: Why isn’t Labour offering a credible alternative in Northern Ireland?

A: The Social Democratic and Labour Party on the other hand are Labour’s official sister party but their support for a United Ireland means for many voters they are not a realistic option.

Answer glossed. If the SDLP didn’t take the view it does on Irish unity, it would not be a realistic option for many other voters.

***

Presumably Brother Sproule is too young to have heard of the Northern Ireland Labour Party, or why it was unable to organise outside Belfast, and why it died the death even there. There is no excuse for this, unless he wilfully refuses to read the many excellent websites on Northern Irish political history – it is not for me, a mere Englishman, albeit married to a Belfast woman whose father was indeed a NILP stalwart in and after World War II, to point him in their direction. Well, he might start with Slugger O’Toole…

Those who think that the Irish should organise themselves around class rather than confession are certainly right in Marxist terms. I wasn’t aware that there were any Marxists in to-day’s Labour Party, however – although it would be typical if its one Irish CLP were, after all, a nest of Trots.

Perhaps that’s why it’s not allowed to contest elections in the Province. After all, it’s been such a success for the Tories.

“Why isn’t Labour offering a credible alternative in Northern Ireland?”

Because the politics and sectarianism of NI are a complete perennial mystery to most folk in Britain?

Right now, I wouldn’t think most folk in NI want to “share” in the economic woes of the Republic but I’m willing to be convinced otherwise by any substantive evidence.

Mike, I am aware of the failure of the NILP over 40 years ago and indeed why it failed but one of the main points here is that we’re in a very different world now than we were then. It also certainly isn’t the case that if the SDLP changed it’s views on the Union that it would get more votes, I did, as you will see, point out that it has a number of policies, (two which I outlined) that don’t sit well with many on the left and this factor perhaps makes it a more unrealistic option than it’s desire to united the island.

As for the failure of the Tories, that should be no reason for Labour not to get involved. What that failure showed was that whilst many Unionists in Northern Ireland could be termed “conservative” they certainly aren’t Tories. In fact in North Down the previous Ulster Unionist Party MP Lady Silvia Hermon ran as an independent and comfortably won in spite of the fact she regularly voted along with Labour in the Commons, highlighting the potential votes for Labour that exist in NI. In addition the Tories suffered from problems on the ground with the UUP who took an age with candidate selection and settled on the name Ulster Convservatives and Unionsts- New Force- with the awful acronym UCUNF. One would anticipate that Labour would learn lessons where the Tories went wrong and there would of course be no link up with a separate local party.

NI voters have regularly had the opportunity to vote for non-sectarian candidates. They’re not interested.

The point is Jimmy that they don’t have the opportunity to vote for anti-sectarian left wing candidates. And whilst Alliance do get a very small share of the vote (around 5%) it does still indicate a that such a vote exists, but once more because of their policies on other matters those on the left do not view them as a credible option.

For the same reason I support the Labour Party in Britain rather than the TUSC or whatever, because it is established and easier to convert than it is to build, isn’t it right to support the SDLP in Northern Ireland? Perhaps they should downplay their support for a United Ireland, but then isn’t the Labour Party in the UK broadly in favour of a United Ireland too?

The membership of Labour in the UK could well be, but the party officially subscribes to the principle of consent as established under the Good Friday Agreement, meaning that Northern Ireland cannot cease to be a part of the UK unless the majority of voters choose that option in a referendum. That’s the policy of the Tories and Lib Dems as well.

And, as I point out, the SDLP are by no means what many of us would want from a “left wing” party.

And neither is Labour as a whole, that’s part of the struggle… If you wish for the SDLP to be less sectarian, then it is IMO better to fight for it to change from within, rather than dividing the left-wing vote with a feeble attempt to build a whole new party.

What is more sectarian, moderately advocating a United Ireland or refusing to join a party purely because of their stance on Irish unity?

[9] Quite so. The SDLP’s position on Corporation Tax is not, I would hazard, one particularly close to its heart (or even known to many people) whilst its stance on abortion is, surely, simply following the voters (SF takes the same view). No doubt when it becomes electorally advantageous to do so, these parties will copy those in Britain and take a sternly agnostic view of the abortion issue as not one for Party politics.

Daniel- The reason that I’m not a member of the SDLP is partly based on the fact that I’m not a nationalist, nor would I call myself a Unionist, and this position certainly doesn’t make me sectarian. But it is also partly based on many other issues which I do not feel the SDLP suitably addresses, and whilst I recognise I can’t join a party with whom I will agree with everything on Labour is the party with which I identify most closely.

Mike- That might well be the case, but should parties not take a stance based on principle, rather than populism?

“The point is Jimmy that they don’t have the opportunity to vote for anti-sectarian left wing candidates.”

They had Gerry Fitt and they burnt his house down when he upset the provos.

Actually Luke nothing would please me more than to be proved wrong about this. The solution always seemed very obvious to me. Stand as an independent pledged if elected to apply for the whip. At least you’ll know if it’s a runner.

[13] I thought that had more or less already happened, with Sylvia Hermon receiving the whip sub rosa.

As a Northern Irish Unionist Left-Winger, I find this article very interesting. It is hard to categorise the 4 main parties in NI as Left or Right, as they generally just jump on whatever bandwagon is currently passing. The UUP blame DUP for spending cut, while themselves supporting the Tories in Westminster. Sinn Fein despite being supposedly left wing support segregated education and cutting corporation tax. I would definately vote Labour if they stood in NI.

10@ 11@ well said both of you

Does NorthernIreland need a LiberalParty?

Disappointing absence of real knowledge about NI in most of this thread.

The SDLP has been in continuing decline since it first suggested that the NI Assembly vote on confessional terms. That single mistake – stripping voting rights from any party not on the the Unionist / Nationalist spectrum – tore any cross community legitimacy from the party, pointed it directly into sectarian waters and condemned it to sink below the stronger nationalist claims of Sinn Fein. The SDLP tore up any opportunity of instigating a cross community politics in NI, despite John Hume having recognised that progess depends on promoting a post-nationalist politics..

I and many others would describe themselves as socialists who believe in the Labour movement. The SDLP are not – they have even discussed merger with Fianna Fail ( the outgoing disaster of a Government in the Republic). There is a NI Liberal Party, and the Alliance Party are members of the Liberal International. Gerry Fitt, who I knew, was put out of his home by a tiny rump of extreme republicans – neither representative nor coherent as a political group in NI.

I’m tired with englishmen and women in the Labour Party telling me what is best for Northern Ireland. It is time for the Labour Party in Northern Ireland to put up or shut up. Let us stand, and if it doen’t happen, then it doesn’t happen.