Evening Standard and TPA hush on £160m Boris bill
9:15 am - September 21st 2012
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Yesterday the Evening Standard buried this story in two short paragraphs deep within its News pages.
Let’s just be clear about this: because of the way these buses have been designed, due to Boris’ insistence, London taxpayers will have to pick up the bill.
Of £160 million.
And the Evening Standard thinks this is worth only two paragraphs buried away.
And where is the Taxpayers’ Alliance? No comment from them either.
Last year the TPA complained about the cost to taxpayers of the salaries of dozens of TfL staff. Yet it’s managed to say nothing about the £160m bill to London taxpayers thanks to Boris Johnson’s genius policies.
Just amazing.
(ht @jamesofwalsh and @currybet)
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Sunny Hundal is editor of LC. Also: on Twitter, at Pickled Politics and Guardian CIF.
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Reader comments
Is there any elaboration on why the buses were specifically designed differently? I know he’s a Tory and so eats black babies for breakfast but whats the gain for Boris in increasing council tax?
@Dave #1:
He gets to bring the Routemaster back (in a more modern form), and to remove the bendy-bus, at the same time.
@1
They were designed differently because Bozza wanted something that was somehow reminiscent of the RM.
So it had to have a rear platform. But modern double deckers don’t have those, so it had to be a new design.
And because of the rear platform there had to be a second set of stairs. This reduces the number of seats, so the BozzaMaster ™ actually seats two less than the original 27′ long RM.
And it has only 22 seats downstairs, despite one major contributor to bus passenger numbers in London being those who find the Tube too challenging – the older and less mobile.
Also, the prototypes can’t carry their design load of 87 passengers because they’d be too heavy.
And,as I’ve said many times, despite Bozza’s bluster, there is no market for these buses outside London. Other operations in the UK use off-the-shelf vehicles, and there’s no potential export market. Cities like Berlin, which operate double deckers, already have a home produced solution, and other cities that operated them in the past have gone over to bendy buses.
Everyone’s out of step bar our Boris.
It was an election pledge. Presumably those who voted for it were willing to pay for it. The Routemaster was an iconic design (and also London-specific, by the way) and of course still runs on a “heritage” route. (The difference, Dave, is the rear platform. This requires a conductor for H&S reasons – so at least the buses are job creators 🙂 )
The ES is entitled to take whatever view it likes, it does seem to have become more right-wing lately – but perhaps that’s what its readers like.
The same goes for the TPA. Perhaps we should all infiltrate it and vote ourselves in as its new committee…
And don’t forget the bill for upto £37m a year for the extra ‘health and safety’ member of staff. They are employed to keep people safe on the rear platform, rather than collect fares.
Darren Johnson has written a punchy article about the problems with the new bus in LeftFootForward
Sounds very much like a politician ” picking winners” Thought tories hated that. As usual with all things state owned ” it’s ok if a conservative is doing it”
Wonder if Boris will make that a centre piece of his big speech to the tory party conference “How I like spending tax payers money”
As for the TPA we know who owns them. Rich, right wing tories. Another bunch of fake right wing libertarians.
Without knowing how the capital purchase is reflected in the operating contracts this is pretty much a non-story.
The same goes for the TPA. Perhaps we should all infiltrate it and vote ourselves in as its new committee…
Touching naivety that the TPA is any sense a member-led organisation…
And don’t forget the bill for upto £37m a year for the extra ‘health and safety’ member of staff. They are employed to keep people safe on the rear platform, rather than collect fares.
I think it’s disgusting wasting tax payers money manufacturing and staffing public transport without any mandate except for an election pledge.
@2, @3, @4 – Thanks for the info.
The interesting question here is why right wing trolls, the TPA and Evening Standard are not up in arms about this massive and unnecesary bill. It is after all the definition of waste that something (a level of new bus capacity) that we could have got without paying (private sector buys), we are paying a lot for.
So does this not show the pathetic state of political discourse under a fiercely partisan structure?
Two things the same are right and wrong depending on who did them – the result of mindless stupidity and an unwillingness to think for one’s self.
btw – this also goes to back my desire to see a real taxpayers alliance. The TPA does nothing to support the case for efficiency in government or out corrupt use of public money and assets. Instead it just lobbies for the Tory Party.
Such a let down.
3
“everyone’s out of step but our boris”
Love that line – well played.
@4
It may have been an election pledge, but when asked about how much it would cost, Boris did his usual bluster and avoided the question.
I suspect most of those who voted for him didnt know it would cost this much.
Yes, I think Shatterface has the last word here.
And what a bunch of philistines you are. These buses are superb and beautiful, why should London have less? The open platform is essential for efficient bus using in central London and it was a huge loss. Surely Londoners on here will agree with that? How many appointments have you missed because traffic stopped the bus a few hundred yards from a stop but you couldn’t get off?
The new routemasters can operate as single staffed buses without the rear platform, by the way, so they should be usable elsewhere, although I expect other cities will go for cheaper bog standard stuff.
Yes, I think Shatterface has the last word here.
And what a bunch of philistines you are. These buses are superb and beautiful, why should London have less? The open platform is essential for efficient bus using in central London and it was a huge loss. Surely Londoners on here will agree with that? How many appointments have you missed because traffic stopped the bus a few hundred yards from a stop but you couldn’t get off ?
The new routemasters can operate as single staffed buses without the rear platform, by the way, so they should be usable elsewhere, although I expect other cities will go for cheaper bog standard stuff.
We should also remember that the cost of having these beautiful buses specially designed for London is about £46m more than buying something off the shelf, so that is the fig we should really be discussing. £46m isn’t nothing, but it is a little bit less frightening, isn’t it?
How much would 600 normal double-deckers have cost?
//”The ES is entitled to take whatever view it likes, it does seem to have become more right-wing lately”// – Mike Killingworth
Lately? It’s always been far to the right.
“How much would 600 normal double-deckers have cost?”
£46m less. So the new buses are a bargain, if you ask me. At LEAST £46m added value.
Another example of socialising the costs (making tax payers pay) whilst privatising the profits (allowing the elite to get rich on the backs of the poor)
What M4E said @11
“Hmm, the stupid is strong with these ones!”
For crying out loud, when are you going to realise that this is a NON STORY???
So we spent a bit of money on R&D to get a really great new bus, the costs of which will more than be recouped when they’re rolled out across the fleet
Can anyone honestly say they would prefer to go back to the bendy bus which was lethal to cyclists, kept catching fire and was known by many as the ‘free bus’ because it was so easy to skip the fare?
£160 million? Hushed up? Rightly so. It would never do for the public to know this sort of stuff. Not good for them and serves no real purpose. The buses must be built so there’s an end of it. Or as Boris would say ‘quod erat demonstrandum, my dears.’
@John Smith #22:
Assuming this isn’t a Poe:
So we spent a bit of money on R&D to get a really great new bus, the costs of which will more than be recouped when they’re rolled out across the fleet
Nope; the new buses cost more to produce than equivalent off-the-shelf designs, so you waste more money the more buses you produce.
Can anyone honestly say they would prefer to go back to the bendy bus
Yes.
which was lethal to cyclists
No more so than other buses – indeed less so. How many cyclists were killed by bendies? (Clue: it’s >-1 and <1).
kept catching fire
Amazing how so many cities around the world (including London) manage to operate them without regular conflagrations. Quick question – when did the last bendy catch fire?
and was known by many as the ‘free bus’ because it was so easy to skip the fare?
And the Bozzamaster has three doors and open boarding, just like the bendy. And one driver, just like the bendy.
On the other hand, the BozzaMaster has room for 87 passengers (although it can’t carry them all at once, since it would be too heavy); whereas the bendy carried 149 passengers,all downstairs.
[24] I presume you are being paid to write this drivel, Robin. Or else you never actually rode a Bendy. Or both.
@Mike Killingworth #25:
[24] I presume you are being paid to write this drivel, Robin.
I wish…
Any chance of a factual rebuttal? Some figures showing Bozzamasters are cheaper than OTS designs? A list of cyclists killed by bendies? A comparison of relative fire risks in bendies and other buses after the bendies were modded in 2003-2004? Anything?
Or else you never actually rode a Bendy.
I did. The 25 or 521 used to take me to City Thameslink.
The 25 or 521 used to take me to City Thameslink.
For what it’s worth, the new 521 gets clogged up along Cannon Street much less often than its bendy predecessor.
[26] Given the skill we show in arguing past each other, Robin, we should both be front-benchers 🙂
Let’s see how often the BozzaBus catches fire 🙁
Reactions: Twitter, blogs
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Jason Brickley
Both Evening Standard and TPA hush over Boris’ £160m bill http://t.co/lprZiiJ9
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sunny hundal
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Primly Stable
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Debbie
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G Phi
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Glass Jar Of Moles
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peters
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Boris hits Londoners with £160m bill – Evening Standard bury it; the TPA remain hush. Amazing http://t.co/cvRXh3iW
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SuperAlly
Boris to cost London taxpayers £160million, and the Tax Payer's Alliance choose to keep quiet about it. http://t.co/asa08iKY
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Robert Cook
Both Evening Standard and TPA hush over Boris’ £160m bill | Liberal Conspiracy http://t.co/5JuaNgsE via @libcon
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dji45
Boris hits Londoners with £160m bill – Evening Standard bury it; the TPA remain hush. Amazing http://t.co/cvRXh3iW
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D.W. Ossenpfeffer
Boris hits Londoners with £160m bill – Evening Standard bury it; the TPA remain hush. Amazing http://t.co/cvRXh3iW
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leftlinks
Liberal Conspiracy – Both Evening Standard and TPA hush over Boris’ £160m bill http://t.co/xxbKO4tV
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Michael
Boris to cost London taxpayers £160million, and the Tax Payer's Alliance choose to keep quiet about it. http://t.co/asa08iKY
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Antony Crossfield
Boris hits Londoners with £160m bill – Evening Standard bury it; the TPA remain hush. Amazing http://t.co/cvRXh3iW
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PLFP
Boris hits Londoners with £160m bill – Evening Standard bury it; the TPA remain hush. Amazing http://t.co/cvRXh3iW
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sillypunk
Boris hits Londoners with £160m bill – Evening Standard bury it; the TPA remain hush. Amazing http://t.co/cvRXh3iW
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Boris hits Londoners with £160m bill – Evening Standard bury it; the TPA remain hush. Amazing http://t.co/cvRXh3iW
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Wladyslaw Mejka
Boris hits Londoners with £160m bill – Evening Standard bury it; the TPA remain hush. Amazing http://t.co/cvRXh3iW
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Tim Parkinson London
Boris hits Londoners with £160m bill – Evening Standard bury it; the TPA remain hush. Amazing http://t.co/cvRXh3iW
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Mitchell Torok
Boris hits Londoners with £160m bill – Evening Standard bury it; the TPA remain hush. Amazing http://t.co/cvRXh3iW
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Katy
Boris hits Londoners with £160m bill – Evening Standard bury it; the TPA remain hush. Amazing http://t.co/cvRXh3iW
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Raam T
Boris hits Londoners with £160m bill – Evening Standard bury it; the TPA remain hush. Amazing http://t.co/cvRXh3iW
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Shifting Grounds
Boris lands Londoners with £160m bill: Evening Standard buries it, TPA stay silent http://t.co/GHLzfNtr via @libcon
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Ian Charles
Boris hits Londoners with £160m bill – Evening Standard bury it; the TPA remain hush. Amazing http://t.co/cvRXh3iW
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michael burke
Boris hits Londoners with £160m bill – Evening Standard bury it; the TPA remain hush. Amazing http://t.co/cvRXh3iW
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Nikeel Kazmi
Boris hits Londoners with £160m bill – Evening Standard bury it; the TPA remain hush. Amazing http://t.co/cvRXh3iW
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Noxi
RT @sunny_hundal: Boris hits Londoners with £160m bill – Evening Standard bury it; the TPA remain hush. Amazing http://t.co/2VG2XO9C
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Colin-Roy Hunter
Boris hits Londoners with £160m bill – Evening Standard bury it; the TPA remain hush. Amazing http://t.co/cvRXh3iW
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Julie Gordon
Boris hits Londoners with £160m bill – Evening Standard bury it; the TPA remain hush. Amazing http://t.co/cvRXh3iW
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Dash
Boris hits Londoners with £160m bill – Evening Standard bury it; the TPA remain hush. Amazing http://t.co/cvRXh3iW
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Jens Carr
Boris hits Londoners with £160m bill – Evening Standard bury it; the TPA remain hush. Amazing http://t.co/cvRXh3iW
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Iain Reeves
Boris hits Londoners with £160m bill – Evening Standard bury it; the TPA remain hush. Amazing http://t.co/cvRXh3iW
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J.P. Grumpsukthuck
Boris to cost London taxpayers £160million, and the Tax Payer's Alliance choose to keep quiet about it. http://t.co/asa08iKY
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James O'Malley
Both Evening Standard and TPA hush over Boris’ £160m bill http://t.co/OPKGYyXp
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James
Boris lands Londoners with £160m bill: Evening Standard buries it, TPA stay silent http://t.co/GHLzfNtr via @libcon
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pauline doyle
Boris hits Londoners with £160m bill – Evening Standard bury it; the TPA remain hush. Amazing http://t.co/cvRXh3iW
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Gods & Monsters
Boris hits Londoners with £160m bill – Evening Standard bury it; the TPA remain hush. Amazing http://t.co/cvRXh3iW
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BevR
Both Evening Standard and TPA hush over Boris’ £160m bill | Liberal Conspiracy http://t.co/L4kUXJwv via @libcon
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Barry Thomas Aris
http://t.co/pw697Gha
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kevin leonard
LONDONERS Still loving #BORIS? http://t.co/vofAPNfI
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Westlake
Evening Standard and TPA hush on £160m Boris bill | Liberal Conspiracy http://t.co/pYgewESv via @libcon
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Juliet Kemp
Boris hits Londoners with £160m bill – Evening Standard bury it; the TPA remain hush. Amazing http://t.co/cvRXh3iW
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Kevin Hotspur
Evening Standard and TPA hush on £160m Boris bill | Liberal Conspiracy http://t.co/IF5o99jA via @libcon
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Mike Shallcross
Boris gets rid of bendy buses on a whim, you get stung for £160m http://t.co/81SGJM7d
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Pabs
RT @sunny_hundal: Boris hits Londoners with £160m bill – Evening Standard bury it; the TPA remain hush. Amazing http://t.co/2VG2XO9C
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Pabs
@standardnews is running a London poverty & unemployment series. This does sit well with that. http://t.co/34YwzWCa @june4th @sunny_hundal
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David Powell
RT @sunny_hundal: Boris hits Londoners with £160m bill – Evening Standard bury it; the TPA remain hush. Amazing http://t.co/2VG2XO9C
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Sam Kington
Boris hits Londoners with £160m bill – Evening Standard bury it; the TPA remain hush. Amazing http://t.co/cvRXh3iW
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etonmess
Evening Standard and TPA hush on £160m bill for #Boris' new bus http://t.co/BnXMF412 via @libcon
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Brendan McGrath
Evening Standard and TPA hush on £160m bill for #Boris' new bus http://t.co/BnXMF412 via @libcon
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Tiernan Douieb
Boris: 'We have brought in a new Routemaster bus. They are the cleanest buses in Europe.' Translation: http://t.co/kc4SiFVZ #cpc12
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Martin Abrams
Boris's new routmaster buses are a vanity project that we the #London taxpayers are paying £160m for http://t.co/nechK0yk yes £160m #CPC12
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janet ewan
Boris's new routmaster buses are a vanity project that we the #London taxpayers are paying £160m for http://t.co/nechK0yk yes £160m #CPC12
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